My richdreamz portfolio - visit my portfolio to learn together!

Quite an year it has been where I have underperformed most portfolios with around 45% returns in CY 2021, post taking out all expenses like tax, brokerage etc. CY2020 has been around 43%.

The PF has fallen 20% from top, due to tech heavy and concentrated nature of the portfolio.

I have exited Dixon, Sona, Route, Nazara with profits & Cartrade with gigantic loss.
I have not sold Indiamart, Zomato, Saregama but have increased allocations in the first two.

CarTrade is my mistake of commission (2021 cycleā€™s biggest mistake of mine) where I have accorded much higher valuations than what Market is ready to give yet. Lesson learned: Stay with leader, only very few companies deserve high valuations and can maintain them. Being a leader in the industry is one of them. Will companies like Cars24 with high PE money take the wind out of Cartrade? I canā€™t answer confidently, so exited. Hitting stop loss is also one of the factors of exiting.

Dixon, Sona: These gave really good protection to my PF during the heavy fall of tech stocks and I think the relative valuations are much higher now and I found HDFC life can provide that 20% with much lesser risk. Sona - the exit will either be prophetic or one of my biggest mistakes if EV really is at the start of the J curve as per the popular narrative around. Iā€™m not sure, so exited. The margins, the narrative, the valuations are all at a high. Typically, best time to time an exit.

Route: Competition coupled with high volume - low margin game, relatively high valuations, frequent media appearances with twitter post promises. I personally do not like such things. When in doubt, exit. Again, the sector seems promising and like the stock, but I will prefer Nykaa over this. Sunder Genomal is an example for me while evaluating promoters.

Nazara: Holding structure is quite a dampener for me. On top of it, there is a strong leader in every segment except esports. Even in esports, the competition is heating up and not sure what moat they have in front of large players. The valuation comfort that I have at 1500 levels is no longer there. In real money gaming, Dream 11 is a leader by far and is profitable, Play to earn - their games are below par compared to others and competition in this segment is crazy with no entry barriers. Even huge games like call of duty has to keep finding new games once the trend or craze dies down and success like these are one in a million. Nykaa is a better bet for me than this. Jet synthesis owns 40% stake in Nodwin who is a competitor to Nazara and are aggressive too. Buying founders at low valuations is not a sustainable approach during these high liquidity times. I was actually interested in esports and then real money gaming, but now I think they cannot be leaders in either of these segments.

Nykaa, HDFC life are the new entrants. HDFC Life probably will stay until the technical upside has been achieved. Nykaa will stay untouched (like Indiamart, Zomato) until the high growth stays which I think is for a long time. The allocation of Nykaa in my PF is unconstitutional, the highest after my Page industries allocation in 2012/13 of around 60%. The accumulation was around 2000-2100. My PF will always stay highly concentrated with high quality stocks, high growth, leaders, promoters with high integrity. I will evaluate Delhivery for the IPO valuations & Policybazaar for results delivery. PhonePe got something right, I believe. People are preferring PhonePe over other apps. Iā€™m not sure what & why of it.

Nykaa: I think market is underestimating the platform nature of Nykaa. I do not want to put numbers here to paint a rosy picture but the advertisement revenue on Nykaa will itself be a sizeable part of revenues by 2025. This ad revenue revenue will come at 60% margins at least. Iā€™m aware of the popular narrative of 1600 PE (foolish narrative), Nykaa is extremely expensive but I believe otherwise and Nykaa is not expensive than any other consumer company is currently. So, it will fall and rise as per the growth achievements and in tandem to other consumer companies valuations. There are consumer companies at less than half the growth of Nykaa and are trading at abnormal valuations. Any change in sustainable growth estimations will have a bearing impact on valuations in both directions.

Super Key point: @gurjota with super high diversified PF has comfortably given more returns in 2021 than my super high concentrated PF. PPFAS portfolio with diametrically opposite philosophy than mine has given better returns than mine. So, it does NOT really matter what type of PF (concentrated, diversified, balanced), what kind of strategy name you give it (growth, value, momentum, technical, fundamental, tech plus funda, thematic) etc. each will perform if you stick to a certain process and keep learning and making changes as per facts. How ever, DO NOT get into very low quality stocks and leave ego outside before you enter stock markets.

The number of twitter followers and threads is not an enough qualification to be a Warren Buffett, who by himself does not have twitter account and sits by a phone on a desk, reading his newspaper and books while going back to his modest home purchased few decades back in a car that is few notches below Tesla. The Mr. Narayana Murtyā€™s (NRN) principle of ā€œcompassionate capitalismā€ is the need of the hour during these distressed times of Covid where the below poverty line people are hit hard compared to rich and upper class. This is diametrically opposite to my thinking in 2015 when I quit job during the highs of bull market. I was of the opinion of whatā€™s wrong with buying vanity items with hard earned money? I think thereā€™s nothing wrong with this even now but just that my enthusiasm to buy a Mercedes waned along with my age and rise of portfolio value, quite contrarily. I now prefer stability, low volatile life. Not sure if this is mid life Crisis every one talks about when entering 40s! Reading Ms. Sudha Murtyā€™s books during nights to my kids >>> watching Peppa Pig. My kids get to do both, not one at the cost of other.

Sorry, the above paragraph is out of syllabus.

I think people stick to a certain approach because thatā€™s what worked for them. High allocation in Page industries in 2012 is what worked for me and from then Iā€™m inclined towards that concentrated approach somehow. Generally speaking.

On a hypothetical scenario where I have to quit managing my own PF and give it to professionals, I will invest in PPFAS even though my approach is opposite to theirs because they stick to a consistent and keep refining process across cycles. My goal is to make money over a benchmark NOT prove one approach or my approach is better than others etc.

Cycles: There are heroes in every cycle. 2013-2015 has them, 2017 has them and even 2021 will have them. The key is to stay relevant across cycles. A certain stocks will find favour in certain type of markets and then they go mum for decades or forever. If you stick with industry leaders, high quality stocks your PF will stay relevant across cycles.

I made mistakes in 2015 cycle after being a hero in 2013-2015 cycle. The same mistake I have not repeated twice but have made different mistakes. I will enumerate them below in the hope that this may help others in the current cycle.

2015 cycle mistakes - Quality ladder mistake: Got into low quality stocks with high allocation. My Low point was Feb 16, 2016. I remember that day because I exited my job to turn into full time investor and lost 35% in a year. Key example: Cupid. I think I wrote this mistake in one of my previous posts back then but I was criticised. It is 6 years hence and the Cupid stock is still to reach those highs while Page industries is 4 times that price even from those HIGH valuations of 10,000 rupees per stock. So, page industries added 35,000 crore in market capitalisation and Cupid could not add 1 crore! This is not to broad brush all stocks and categorise them but understand the companies case by case and follow the story, separate narrative from reality.

Iā€™m a product of 2013 bull market and if I were to know then that trading, active investing has so many snakes and ladders, may be I would have thought more before I took my decision to quit working. Cut your PF size into HALF from top, assume 5% returns for 2 years and account for your expenses and see if you can bear that pain, patience and then decide. Stress, pressures, peer comparison will force you to make mistakes. Psychologically, you need to be strong. So, anyone thinking of quitting and joining markets, make sure what you are getting into. 2020-2021 is once in a decade opportunity. Do NOT extrapolate. Probably, extrapolation is the biggest mistake investors make.

On the beautiful other side of it, if you survived, then the water is calm like the middle of an ocean. You have weathered the rough seas that exist at the start of the ocean. So, I think it takes 3 bull-bear cycles (equal to 10 years roughly?) for certain amount of maturity. Of course, there are some genius investors that I come across at such a tender age of 28 years who are more matured and better than me at 39 years now.

2017 cycle mistakes - Valuation mistake: Quality stocks are worth the ā€œpriceā€ but only if they continue to show the growth. Until the growth comes back, it goes into side ways correction after a steep fall and when the growth comes back and everything else is same they will break out into new highs. Either have patience to hold them across cycles or know what you are getting into and when a mistake is made, exit without ego. Opportunity cost in markets is very high. KNOWING what the current price is factoring is a key factor for active investors.

Do all this drama of active investing or simply follow technical analysis with stop loss or just be a holder (HODLer!) of high quality compounders for at least 3 bull-bear cycles.

Stick to stocks where you have reasonable understanding of the fundamentals and know the key drivers of earnings and key factors of re-rating / de-rating.

2021 cycle: I, somehow see a repeat of past cycles, where the 3rd rung stocks in a sector are high flying while the leaders are consolidating in a range. People are giving gyan, narratives, 100 year stories, tech eating world narratives, twitter spaces, a particular hero / fund manager of this cycle starts giving lectures to industry stalwarts. HDFC Life, Kotak bank, HDFC are being ridiculed while a particular low quality stock has gone up by 3x. All these examples, observations point to froth. I would be careful in my stock selection. Iā€™m on the look out for what mistakes I will learn in this cycle, hopefully, not fatal.

Some significant choices giving me hard lessons:
I have exited all the stocks mentioned below, but lessons remained.

Year 2020 - Hawkins vs. Dixon: I still remember thinking which one to buy in 2020 last quarter. Hawkins was around 5000/5500 and Dixon around 9500 (pre-split). I bought Hawkins because of low valuations compared to Dixon. Since then Hawkins is more or less consolidating while Dixon TRIPLED. Cycle may turn but not before hitting extremes and in the interim giving significant lessons on valuations, market. Market IS right actually, Since then, Hawkins profits have stagnated with very low revenue growth while Dixon revenues galloped. Is Dixon now at a stage where Page was at 15000 levels in 2015? Time will tell based on revenue growth acceleration or deceleration. It is important, if you are a MEDIUM term investor, at what valuations and growth expectations you are entering the stock. While this may remain immaterial for 3-5 market cycles. Even otherwise, the long term growth projections, sector size is very important, Dixon long term growth may be at 25% while for Hawkins it is at 10% with limited market size.

Year 2020 - ITC vs Page: Before typing the stock name in my brokerage page I vividly remember, ITC around 200, Page at 20000. I bought Page with the thinking that high growth will be rewarded with higher valuations and re-rating. Since then Page more than doubled while ITC is still. Super high valuation got even higher while the lowest valuation stocks remained as is. The role of growth in valuations is misunderstood by markets. There is no point of high cash on balance sheet or high RoCE if you can not re-invest them for higher growth.

+++++Think of it like this+++++: What is the point of having 1000 acres land lying vacant while you can build a productive Dmart store on 1 acre of land and make profits terminally. Over a period of 20 years the profits made on 1 acre land are much higher than 1000 acres land lying vacant. Here 1 acre >>> 1000 acres. This is really a significant lesson for me. Milk the limited assets productively >>> Huge Assets lying around under utilised. Thatā€™s why Nykaa, Dmart will ALWAYS be valued significantly higher than other high dividend and low growth stocks and experts will KEEP saying that Nykaa or a Dmart or a Page valuations are super expensive than ITC. BUT, for a medium term investor entry valuations do matter. Buying Dmart at 1000 is NOT the same as buying Dmart at 5000. One bought at 1000 will have a different story than the one bought at 5000. The difference between these two is ā€œwisdom, experience, patience, stock marketā€, whatever name you give it.

Year 2014 - Page vs Hawkins: Page double for me then while Hawkins fell. There was a strong urge to sell Page and buy Hawkins. But I refrained with one thought, ā€œdo not sell your performers while buying laggardsā€. This has been one of the biggest lessons.

Year 2015 - Page vs. Cupid: Sold Page while getting the decision right at the time and buying Cupid. What a fatal mistake!

Selling Dmart around 2100: There were bigger mistakes in terms of returns but this one stands out particularly because Dmart is exactly the type of company I invest in and yet the urge/ itch to switch took the better of me.

So many mistakes, but at this time Iā€™m tired of writing. All the best!

A 20% entire PF compounding over 10 years >>> two 10x stocks >>>> A hero of one cycle and a zero of next 2 cycles and repeat.

Disclaimer: There are transactions in last one month in all the stock names I have mentioned above, either buy or sell. Iā€™m not a sebi registered analyst and have no qualification to suggest stocks to anyone. I will sell or trim when growth does not match valuations accorded. Iā€™m writing my personal experience and thatā€™s it.

56 Likes

Great write-up. I struggle with the same fight in the head everytime I have to take stock entry/exit decision. But, I am yet to become as clearer in my approach as you are .

Valuation is comparatively easy to calculate than growth and hence bias goes towards value always, atleast for me. I had one time only three stock portfolio of Hawkins, Page, Repco. In retrospect, all decisions I made after that were wrong of different degrees, except holding Page from 8000 level to today. That one right took care of lot of mistakes.(even page allocation was wrong as it was costly at 8000)

Your write-up and allocation motivated me to study Nykaa. Thanks for the pointer. For me allocation is the most important game in town.

Thanks once again for a great write-up.

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Hi Hrishi - You are some one who held Page from 8000 till 44000, you would have seen a hell of a roller coaster, so you are excellent in psychology of markets.

Personally, technical analysis helps me in entry and exit decisions. Fundamental analysis is an ā€œopinionā€ of an analyst which may be biased or not backed by money, how ever in technical analysis - the charts represent the ā€œactionā€ taken by all market participants backed by money.

Let me try to explain Page industries price behaviour by combining technical and fundamental analysis.

Rear view mirror explanation (20/20):
36700 is a very strong resistance and when it took out with volumes probably by an FII who was reasonably sure of 25% growth this quarter, breakout traders and other fundamental guys got in and pushed it until 42000 where it encountered strong resistance due to profit booking by market participants due to various reasons like stretched valuations, nay sayers etc and was consolidating from 38000-42000 by touching the breakout point. How ever, with strong commentary from retail companies like Titan gave a further confirmation that Page would too do well, so it took out 42000 and touched 45000.

Short to medium term prediction based on technicals and fundamentals:
(for newbies, this is not price target, so please do not misunderstand the post)

Case 1: If the company delivers on the market expectation, the stock will correct and consolidate in a range where the buyers from 32000 etc will book out and who bought at 44000-42000 will be trapped. 65 times FY24 for 20-25% growth is above the market threshold currently.

Case 2: If results do not deliver as per market expectation, then 37000-36000 is imminent.

Case 3: Now, if the deliver higher growth and guides for such high growth rates for coming quarters then the stock will fly off to 50000 plus levels. 65 PE for 30% growth rate still has potential for upside as per market comparative valuations. The valuations must be read in the context of interest rates, market sentiment also. If the mother market de-rates these PEs may contract.

This is all medium term explanation but for long term holders like you this should not matter as long as the long term growth rates of the company is between 18%-20%.

As per me, even after the interest rate higher, the higher end of the rate will be lower than the highest rate of the past rate hike cycle, so the valuations are upped permanently across the board, unless the current rate cycle high takes out 2013 rate hike highs and interest rates are headed back to 2005 levels. In my opinion, the lower interest rates may be a feature. Technology is inflation killer as it eliminates the supply chain inefficiencies and improves corporate productivity. In fact I have a better thought but can not say it publicly for it may be outrageous. Again, predicting macro and taking stock market decision is a sure shot way to disaster. This paragraph is purely academic and there will be vehement opposing views as well.

Nykaa: This entire business has been built with less than 100$ MUSD! Amazing capital efficiency. Yes, the stock allocation and purchase decision is entirely personal and subjective but we should be objective in this process. As per me, Nykaa could have entirely avoided the IPO and remain a private company as there is NO need for fresh capital and whatever little needs are there, banks will fall head over heels to lend at attractive rates. Sunder Genomal said there was no need for Page IPO as they are already profit making and there is no need for capital and true to his words he never raised capital through equity! So, without an IPO page would have entirely existed. Some promoters want to share wealth, be disciplined about capital allocations etc.
I read on twitter that Amazon makes 20 billion USD through advertisements on its app at 68% margins. This is second only to AWS profits. Amazing, isnā€™t it? The optionalities in Nykaa business are huge. Of course all these are blue sky projections. There are many hurdles, competitors to cross, new business lines to be created, growth has to be maintained at these very high levels, regulations must be tackled, fashion business competes against the likes of Myntra, Amazon etc. Here, we must track the story every quarter and take appropriate decisions. So, it is not all hunky dory, but needs some effort from our side to study the business model and understand why market is valuing it so high. If any of the factors impact the high growth permanently, the de-rating will also be severe.

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Can I ask what books or resources helped you most to understand technical analysis
I have read a few books and before that all my analysis was fundamental however after having read a few books I have given up on any fundamental analysis other than a cursory look at it before a final buy
I would really like to know what helped you the most and hope to learn from them myself

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Could you pls throw more light on how you would justify or explain the valuations of Nykaa.

I understand that looking at profits is not correct, because they are investing in growth, hence one cannot refer to EPS or PE.

Cannot look at PBV cuz the growth of business doesnā€™t depend on size of book. Unlike a bank or a high Capex biz.

I like the business model, but looking at 1L Cr market cap I feel a bear market could give a good entry.

As a matter of fact, I see great prospects for PayTM. It is ubiquitous. Its app is world class. Again, 75000Cr valuation makes me wonder.

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Hi @edwardlobo

Yes, please further learn technical analysis and take baby steps while implementing in real world markets. Stay away from futures & options unless you have achieved razor sharp skills both charts wise and emotionally.

The below books helped me in technical analysis and behaviour and emotional aspects:

Remember: Books help only so far, after that more books do not make much difference, itā€™s all in looking at hundreds of charts and correlating the charts to ā€œfundamentals & price actionā€ to news/ rumours/ results. Do not bury into so many indicators, most of them are lag indicators. The below are the most important for any chartist:

  1. Price action
  2. Volume
  3. Visual patters

Technical analysis books:

  1. Technical analysis explained by Martin J Pring
  2. The Visual Investor by John J Murphy
  3. Japanese candle stick charting techniques by Steve Nison
  4. Market Wizards series of books by Jack D. Schwager
  5. Trade like a Stock Market Wizard by Mark Minervini

(First 3 books are theoretical in nature while 4 & 5 are practical in nature and easy reads). I like Markā€™s approach to markets. Follow him on twitter, if you please.

Behavioural aspects books - most important:

  1. How to trade in stocks by Jesse Livermore
  2. Reminiscences of a stock operator by Jesse Livermore
  3. How I made $2000000 in stock market by Nicholas Darvas

Once you start reading, you will find so many books actually.

Happy reading!

@jamit05

I would not venture into justifying valuations. Stock market is like a buffet where one can choose per their liking - high growth high valuation, low growth reasonable valuation, dividend protection etc. All depends on what returns one wants to achieve and what risk one wants to take for those return expectations correspondingly.

I actually use EV/sales for such high growth, starting stage companies. Also, please compare our companies with companies with similar growth characteristics available in global markets. Do not compare a 45% revenue grower to a 15% profitable and stable company. You say, ā€œOMG, 1 lakh market cap? - so expensiveā€, while I say ā€œOnly 1 lakh?ā€. May be because of our different observations, time frames etc? Again, this is not a recommendation for anyone to buy, these are just my thoughts based on my experience and as you have seen from my posts, I have got it so wrong in so many stocks, so many times!

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I spend sometime reflecting upon the power of 45% growth, and how should the market perceive it. Its not everyday that such a juggernaut presents itself.

One Lakh is not that big a number when one puts things in perspective. In the same breath, Nykaas Mcap spiked from 5000Cr to 1L Cr in a two years time span leading to its listing in the market. Thatā€™s 20x jump.

I feel, this will cause some cool off time. I donā€™t expect the stock price to go anywhere significant in the immediate future. This will give me an opportunity to learn more about the business, study quarterly reports and mainly assess the managements integrity: the kind of guidance they give, and present a true picture of the internals of the business, as opposed to some concalls that are all about painting a pretty picture.

This business is worth a high allocation.

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Oh, why should anyone rush into any investment decision without proper due diligence and conviction?! Thereā€™s nothing called missing out in markets, opportunities are aplenty.

In fact, one should be mindful of people making high claims, promised returns offers, missing opportunities bait etc. in markets. Most people have their own axe to grind on Twitter, forums.

Please read the below article and understand, if you havenā€™t already. It helps in understanding and hopefully overcoming human biases.

Beginners must also read the book:

Thinking, fast and slow

by

Daniel Kahneman.

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Iā€™m down 23.4% from all time high made on 12th October 2021 and 7% down this month - so far. These are the gut wrenching falls that a concentrated and a tech heavy, high growth portfolio has to take.

For a beginner who sees all hunky dory portfolio performance updates on social media it important to know the pitfalls so a balanced view can be formed - hence this update.

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I think all depends on ur PF sizing and allocationā€¦enough diversification without dilution is the keyā€¦also sometimes going heavy in few new age business does not help PFā€¦my PF now 3% down from the peak made last Monday and still around 13% up from Octoberā€¦

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Hi! I am really interested in reading about your journey from starting to leaving your job. Can you link to a blog piece or posts on VP I can read to get insights on how your journey has been? Would really appreciate it.

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Hi Jotpreet

@Jotpreet

Thanks for showing interest. This thread of mine will give enough info on my journey from immaturity to some sort of sanity.

Iā€™m currently licking my wounds with tail between my legs. Any specific questions you have, please message me in private in this forum as my approach was risky, high alpha and may not suit for everybody to write here.

Basically, any destruction or fortune needs multiple factors to come together along with your own preparation and courage to strike when the time is opportune.

In my case - luck, right mentor, concentrated position in a super high quality stock, bearish market conditions (2012-2013), holding patiently played a critical role.

If I were a new investor, I would start with a mutual fund and do an SIP relentlessly, diligently and accumulate good corpus and all this while learn from books, read how super seniors like @hitesh2710 approach stocks, markets with practical approach. For example, Laurus labs was clearly showing head & shoulders breakdown pattern which Hitesh wrote at the time and I too was observing the technical structure but some market participants were bullish then based on fundamentals. There were several such examples. Of course a lot of biases are involved to which Iā€™m also a slave of. Read all Hitesh posts, they come with a lot of experience.

Current environment is ripe for slow accumulation of high quality stocks and hold them for 2 market cycles. The KEY word is high quality.

The usual disclaimer applies as Iā€™m not a sebi registered analyst or a financial planner to suggest portfolio for public.

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Regarding IndiaMart -
(I have a concentrated position and there are buy transactions so, I have vested interest in the stock)

Some members have rightly pointed out the ā€œrevenues from operationsā€ are not the right way to look at IndiaMart as they represent ā€œrolling 20 monthā€ and are lagging indicators.

In the way IndiaMartā€™s results seemed positive even during heights of pandemic, they are not as negative now during recovery because of the above logic.

SaaS, subscription businesses have such revenue recognition policies and is the right way of accounting.

The right metrics to look at are (as they represent lead indicators):

  • Past quarter collections growth (which is growing at 25% in Q3 2022 and 36% in Q2, 2022) and this will reflect as the quarters of slow growth gets replaced with this in future.

  • Net subscribers addition: This quarter had 5800 and management is confident at maintaining and exceeding 6000 in quarters ahead and in fact the high cost base is due to the company preparing for this growth. The management is ultra conservative, like the Infosys, and generally do not paint too positive a picture. How ever, in yesterdayā€™s call, Dinesh was optimistic on growth acceleration based on collections and new net additions.

There is euphoria to buy at 9500 and there is pessimism now at 5000 and the truth lies somewhere in between. And, there are some people, who claim, I told you so in both cases! In short term - the long term investors will look foolish in front of these crystal gazers. I clearly made a decision not to sell at those elevated prices and hold on to such companies for really long term and let compounding work. Thereā€™s a lot of opportunity cost as well as price destruction from top. Who bought at 9000 will curse & who bought at 2000 will have the staying power.

This whole hullabaloo about interest rates is a bit over the top as the top of FED rates of this cycle would be 2.4 in March 2024. Let us cross the bridge in 2024 and see if the rates will go back to 6 as seen in 2007 (unlikely), however, the current price action is like that!

Competition:

Interestingly, a competitor whose 5 year revenue growth rate is ā€œZeroā€ and so is behaving like a bond and even worse if you take equity risk premium into picture and this company has a history of promising a google and keeps venturing into new areas with high decibel advertising - is now trading around 9-10 times forward sales while Indiamartā€™s 5 year revenue growth rate is 22% and is trading at 12-13 times sales. Even staples that are single digit growers are at 12 times sales! Platform companies margins are at least ā€œdoubleā€ of staples and so are growth rates. Anyway, comparing EV/Sales for staples and platform businesses is not correct, my bad.

Real bubble:

In my opinion, the real bubble is in consumer discretionary names (say, an adhesive company) where the growth rates are in single digits while the valuations are ridiculously high. High valuations must be backed by high growth, otherwise it is false narrative.

Finally:
Anyway, I always have strong opinions and do not shy away from writing them. Iā€™m holding onto my high growth tech names (as long as the growth remains) despite some people in social media comparing them to tomatoes! To each his own actually and based on ones risk appetite and return expectations and volatility tolerance one must select companies to invest in.

All the best guys and the usual disclaimer of not being a sebi registered analyst or a financial advisor applies!

12 Likes

Great post and completely agree with the whole summary on Indiamart. Itā€™s almost unvelievable how markets donā€™t understand some businesses or just think forward only for next 1-2 quarters.

Collections from customer is the leading indicator of the future revenue for Indiamart and we can see that company should show 20%+ growth in FY23 (next fiscal). Markets ignored FY21 collections which was absolutely flat vs FY20 (in fact -2% lower) and is now hammering the stock with 20% growth, what can I say!!! They are just fixated with the current quarter and next quarter margins. And the company MD has been highlighting in all the previous 3-4 concalls that 50% EBITDA margins are not sustainable and steady state margins of the company are 35-40% especially once some of the operational costs come back post Covid.

But alas, markers are markets! It never crossed my mind that market participants have been valuing this business on 50% EBITDA margin on steady state basis as I assumed markets are smart/efficient.

Love this and finally found someone calling a spade a spade!!! I almost need to eat digene everytime I look at Pidiliteā€™s stock and valuations, impossible to digest.

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Awesome ride @richdreamz . Slightly unrelated question, you may prefer to answer the way you are comfortable with. How did you calculate that you have enough surplus to quit the job and have you created income streams other than dividends ? i know there are many youtube videos on the same but would trust people who did it.

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Iā€™m sorry for interfering in between. But the following rule can be considered while deciding the corpus needed before retiring.
Let us say we need Rs X as the final corpus. We shall find out ā€˜Xā€™ in terms of multiple of monthly expenses.
Let 'Y" is my average monthly expenses at the time of my retirement.
Now, let us consider four states of financial independence. , ā€œUltra-comfortableā€, ā€œComfortableā€, ā€œMinimum comfortā€ and ā€œSatisfactoryā€.

  1. For Ultra comfortable,
    Total corpus X = 600 x Avg monthly expenses = 600 x Y
    e.g. If my average monthly expenses is 50,000 rupees, then the corpus I should accumulate = 600 x 50,000 = 3,00,00,000/- = 3 Cr
  2. For comfortable, X = 480 x Y
    e.g. with Rs50,000 monthly expenses, corpus required = 2 Cr 40 L
  3. For Minimum Comfort, X = 400 x Y
  4. For Satisfactory, X = 342 x Y
    e.g. with 50,000 monthly expenses, corpus required = 1 Cr 71 L

To arrive at the above figures, the following assumptions are made.
We may consider a 4% rate of return as reasonably safe return expectations. (It may sound ultra-defensive, but it is better to err on the side of caution! )
Hence, every year, we need to take out 2%, 2.5%, 3%, or 3.5% from the corpus of Rs X, to get the amount we need for the expenses in the above four cases respectively.
Let me explain the mathematics used to arrive at the figure in ā€œUltra-comfortableā€ with an example.
We recall, X is the total corpus and Y is the amount we need for monthly expenses. Here we take out 2% from the amount X annually.
2/100 x X x 1/12 = Y
On simplifying the above equation, we get X = 600 x Y.
Hope this is useful!
Regards
Mahesh

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Thats nicely explainedā€¦just curious, what about inflation and also the age at which one is retiring?. Should they not be part of the equation? Thanks

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I think problems remains for investors like me who are half baked and bought it in mid levels.
Question for me is time cost, definitely story seems solid but donā€™t have patience to let story play out for next quarters and at same time there are lot of stocks at good level to take fresh position that makes me tempted to exit instead of average out :smiley:

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Very Nicely categorized.
As rightly asked by investor_no_1, the retiring age is very important to consider. Also what kind of financial obligations of high ticket value is equally important. Another aspect which many struggle incase of early retirement is cashflow management. Would be great to hear additional thought process in this line. Strategy to tackle inflation in my opinion is widely known i.e. equity investing.
Thanks for great illustrations.

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As long as one is daily occupied with the daily chatter of the market, these thing will happen naturally. Plus one more aspect is how comfortable one is with his current financial situation, net worth, job and family obligations. In my experience and opinion it takes minimum two decades to reach a status of financial independence. Getting rich or independence shouldnā€™t be hurried :slight_smile:

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