Gujarat Reclaim Rubber (now GRP Ltd)

Thanks Subbu,

You made a very valid point, and we at ValuePickr are weak at carrying out proper peer comparisons!

I thought about this, and I think I know the reason why:)

We expect the idea originator(s)/defender(s) to keep supplying all the maal. Very few guys take the trouble of taking forward the work of others by putting up data themselves that question the originators premises meaningfully.

I wish there were more show of hands, that did not want to be spoonfed, all the time. And that would be real collaborative work that enriches all of us!

I am hoping some of you will take this good-natured jibe sportingly and take the trouble of digging out data on Balaji rubber and Elgi rubber, the main competitors of Gujarat reclaim, to take this discussion meaningfully forward.

-Donald

well, some people are good at digging up data and others are good at analysing it.

Balaji rubber, i believe is a pvt company. So I wasn’t able to find anything. They have a capacity of 30,000 MT p.a.

I found a report on Elgi but unable to attach. Just google “elgi rubber expansion” - 3rd link.

They dont seem to be large players. So I dont think them expanding will pose a big problem.

http://www.tyrepress.com/News/business_area/25/22233.html

Elgi Rubber acquires Dutch rubber recycler

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Created: April 20, 2011 11:16:00 AM

Elgi Rubber International Limited has announced the acquisition of a 100 per cent interest in Rubber Resources B.V. on 16 March, 2011. Elgi, headquartered in India, has operations in the USA, Brazil, East Africa and other parts of the Indian Subcontinent, focusing on rubber recycling, especially in tyres and retreading. Elgi says the acquisition ameans a strong presence in Europe and big step towards being a worldwide supplier of reclaim to the rubber industrya.

Rubber Resources, based in Maastricht, the Netherlands, is dedicated to recycling polymers a specifically from natural rubber and butyl-based products. Elgi says it is a aprimary supplier of reclaimed rubber to leading tyre companies and rubber goods manufacturers in demanding markets like Europe, the United Sates and Japana. It has more than 50 yearsa experience in recycling rubber. Elgi says the acquisition will allow it to aprovide products and solutions that were until now parts of two different domains and this union will bring synergies to customers and suppliers worldwidea.

Elgi envisages Maastricht as the centre for its growth in the rubber reclaim business and in developing new processes, products and solutions in rubber recycling. Rubber Resources and the ECORR brand will become the trade name for Elgias rubber reclaiming businesses.

http://www.rubber-resources.com/

http://www.rubber-resources.com/upload/File/Brochures/01_PlantMaastricht.pdf

25,000 MT capacity

During those five decades of recycling they have been able to learn, improve and use that experience for the customers of today. The Maastricht plant is still the main location and headquarters where they devulcanise natural and butyl rubber. Next to this plant, their reclaim activities grew when they were bought by the Elgi group in 2011. The two Elgi reclaim plants in India extended the devulcanized rubber capacity by 50%.

So total capacity is ~37,500 MT per year

http://www.rubberreclaim.com/companyprofile.html

Balaji rubber production capacity is 36,000 MTPA

Synthetic reclaim rubber contributes 50% of GRRPL’s revenues, has higher margins and is expected to be an important growth driver in the next 2-3 years.

Thought we should spend more time on understanding this. Elgi rubbers acquisition of Rubber resources, Netherlands which has significant Butyl rubber capacity should also be alerting us.

Synthetic Rubber from Rubber Board website can be a good starting point. Have a look.

Please help dig more on synthetic rubber.

Gujarat Reclaim is in the Reclaims business.

So it does not make Synthetic rubber. It makes synthetic rubber reclaims. In this specific case it makes Butyl rubber Reclaims, not Butyl Rubber!

Check the Products Link: http://www.gujaratreclaim.com/products.htm page on GRRPL website for more

Link: Archives Top and Latest News - mint?

Hi everyone,

I have now had a chance to go through the financials and share my opinion. I agree with Ayush/Donald that this is a good company with good ROCE and good financials.

The only problem I feel is the Company does not have significant pricing power. Revenue increases only come about due to capacity expansion. I have noticed that FY 11 fixed asset balance has gone up i.e. clearly company is undertaking expansion plans.

I do not see any reason for a re-rating of the Company as such, but as the EPS increases due to the expansion the share price will go up.

As always risks are - slowdown in Europe, high inflation in India etc.

Views welcome.

Hi,

Have tried finding out about nos of Elgi Rubber, but the problem is - they have merged several cos together and because of that, details and margins etc are not available.

As perstatuaryfiling of financial details before listing, got the following details - they have capacity of 12600 MT of reclaimed rubber and in FY 11, production was 11561 MT. So may be this is their capacity in India.

We should try to extract financial and segment details of Elgi Rubber - its a listed co.

Regards,

Ayush

Hi,

I have just been looking at the whole thread again and wanted to point something out. Per Donald, the installed capacity is 41,000 MT in 2010. Per Ayush, capacity expansion of 50% is planned in the near future.

Ayush also states that per the rubber board website organised market is about 80,000 MT (pasted below).

PS: As per the Rubber board website, I think the organised capacity for reclaim rubber is abt 80000 MT…hence Guj Reclaim has more than 50% market share:))

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So another 20,000 odd tons are coming up to the market in the near future. This is about 25% of the current organised market. Where is the Company going to sell this added capacity? Surely, the domestic industry is not growing by 25% per annum, in the current economic scenario? I dont see the export market i.e. Europe growing by 25% either. It will be quite difficult to get market share from other competitors in a commoditised industry like rubber reclaiming.

I think margins could be hit after the capacity expansion. I guess you would have also noticed that in the past whenever the company expanded margins did take a hit.

It is still a good investment but it should probably not be a large part of ones portfolio.

Alternative views welcome…

Some good points coming out. My observations:

1). There are few players in the organised Reclaim rubber industry. We know of only 2 other players with any significant capacity in India. And Gujarat reclaim is the 3rd largest in the world after 2 unlisted Chinese players. 60000 MT may again be 50-60% of the domestic market capacity. (36000+17500 of Balaji & Elgi; Elgi has now 25000 in Netherlands)

2). We must remember though that topline and bottomline main growth driver is Synthetic reclaim rubber. Synthetic reclaim rubber market is a separate market.

3). Capacity has been enhanced by GRRPL after 3 years of careful consolidation, securing RM linkages, and I am sure proper market planning.

4). But just like in the 2007 expansion, there is real risk of a slowdown staring them in the face from export markets. The last time round margins were hit not because of expansion, but because of a recession immediately following, and this time too the same risks abound.

I haven’t been able to place a finger on this yet, and so I have stayed away so far, despite weakening in the counter. Especially as there are others equally inviting, without this additional risk!

We need some more questions answered. The AGM on 25th August, may give us the opportunity as some volunteers are attending.

Let’s frame questions quickly, so we can equip the guys visiting the AGM to do justice!

My top of the mind questions: Pls help add more, latest by tomorrow 24th Aug.

1). Product Segments & contribution

Natural rubber reclaim and Synthetic rubber reclaims are the two main segments. In synthetic rubber reclaims you have Butyl, EPDM, Nitrile, Latex.

Kindly throw some light on the end-user industry for synthetic rubber reclaims and the demand-supply situation -both domestic and exports.What kind of margins are enjoyed in synthetic rubber reclaims?What kind of revenue contribution is coming from synthetic rubber reclaims today? Is Butyl reclaims contributing the most within synthetic rubber reclaims? Which is the most promising, and why?

How is the RM procurement situation in synthetic rubber reclaims? How have you secured your RM supplies on this front?

2). Exports - Geographies and Contribution

What is the exports sales contribution currently? Kindly provide the Geographical spread - how much from Europe, US and other markets. How much of export sales is booked in Euros and how much in US$? Do you have higher margins from Export sales?

3). Growth - Outlook

You have recently expanded capacity to 60000 MTPA after 3 years of consolidation. 1QFY12 sales grew at a healthy 31% and PAT grew at 47% over the last year quarter. You had guided for a 30% growth CAGR for next few years. There is also expansion work of 10000 MTPA ongoing for the South based facility, which will take capacities to 70000 MTPA by FY12.

Kindly comment on the current outlook and plans. What is the sense that you have got from your customers, especially Exports? What is your order book size at the moment? If Exports demand sees a decline, what are the plans to counter this risk? Can domestic market absorb additional sales? How do you see margins playing out in the rest of the year?

4). Elgi Rubber acquiring Rubber Resources, BV, Netherlands

Netherlands based Rubber Resources has 25000 MT. They also seem to have excellent comnpetencies in Butyl rubber reclaims.

How does GRRPL see this development? How big is the reclaim rubber market, and how competitive? Is there space for all?

Hi everyone,

Sorry for the delayed reply. I know its kinda urgent. These are my questions:

  1. Please describe you company’s specific competitive adv. vis.a.vis your competitors?

  2. How do you fare against Chinese competitors?

  3. Are you aware of any of your competitors (domestic & foreign) expanding capacity? Do you see the risk of excess capacity bringing down margins?

  4. Are you seeing a slowdown in order book due to the high inflation in India and slow/no growth economies in Europe because of lower automotive sales and high oil prices?

  5. you are a big player in the domestic and international market. You have strong capacity increases planned. Do you think there is enough demand for your products to justify the expansion? In other words, do you expect strong industry growth or gain market share from competitors? What is your rationale for expansion?

  6. What kind of pricing power if any do you enjoy. Are you able to pass on any increases in raw material prices to end users?

Thanks a lot for the people attending the AGM and helping us all out.

Posting further questions on behalf of Ayush:

1). The global environment has slowed down quite a lot but the co has taken some aggressive exp. So how will the co be able to utilize additional capacities? Timeline for coming up of capacity.

2). Is the market itself growing or will the co be gaining market share? (Its already among top 5). So how will the co overcome these challenges?

3). How is the new plant at Solahpur going? Any probelms/challenges there? Are the margins similar to existing levels?

4). Similarly the new plant at Erode will be a altogether new state for the co. What are the risks? What are the timelines for the expansion?

5). Mot MacDonald has been appointed…won’t this make their project expensive than competitors? On the other hand, what will be the major benefits/edge on this project?

6). The co gets a major share of its revenues from export market. There are more and more risks on the export front…what is the co’s view and plans ahead?

7). Currencies can be volatile going forward. Does the co hedge its revenues…strategy etc

8). What is the competitive advantage for the co?

9). As the co is entering the mid cap space, more analysts would be interested in understanding the co and participating in growth ahead. Co should focus on more of shareholder communication

10). Equity is very small and stock is illiquid. There is need for bonus + stock split + NSE Listing.

10 Questions for Gujarat Reclaim Management -25th Aug, 2011

1). Product Segments & Contribution

Natural rubber reclaim and Synthetic rubber reclaims are GRRPLâs two main segments. In synthetic rubber reclaims you have Butyl, EPDM, Nitrile, Latex.

Kindly throw some light on the end-user industry for synthetic rubber reclaims and the demand-supply situation -both domestic and exports.Who are your customers? What kind of margins are prevalent in synthetic rubber reclaims?What kind of revenue contribution is coming from synthetic rubber reclaims today? Is Butyl reclaims contributing the most within synthetic rubber reclaims? Which is the most promising, and why?

How is the RM procurement situation in synthetic rubber reclaims? How have you secured your RM supplies on this front?

2). Exports - Geographies and Contribution

What is the exports sales contribution currently? Kindly provide the Geographical spread - how much from Europe, US and other markets. How much of export sales is booked in Euros and how much in US$? Do you have higher margins from Export sales?

3). Competition âDomestic and Export markets

In the domestic market you have Balaji Rubber (36000 MTPA) and Elgi Rubber as the main competitors. Elgi Rubber with acquisition of Netherlands based Rubber Resources (42000 MTPA). Both companies also seem to have competencies in Butyl rubber reclaims.

Who are your major competitors in the Export markets? How big is the overall Reclaim rubber market, and what is the Industry rate of growth? How is Gujarat Reclaim competitively placed today - Is GRRPL growing faster than the Industry growth and grabbing market share from Competitors. If yes, why? What are your competitive advantages?

How strong is Chinese competition? In terms of capacities, how much bigger are they compared to GRRPL? Does GRRPL have any advantages in terms of the Product mix today vis–vis Chinese competition? What is the price differential, if any, between Chinese and GRRPL products to OEMs.

How is the demand supply situation generally? If you had the full 80,000 MTPA capacities today, would you be able to sell comfortably? Are you aware of competitors expanding capacities aggressively? Is it likely that the demand-supply situation will get skewed with volatility in European and US economy?

4). Growth - Outlook

You have recently expanded capacity to 60000 MTPA after 3 years of consolidation. There is also expansion work of 10000 MTPA ongoing for the Erode facility, which might take capacities to 70000 MTPA by FY12. 1QFY12 sales grew at a healthy 31% and PAT grew at 47% over the last year quarter. You had guided for a 30% growth CAGR for next few years.

**Kindly comment on the current outlook and plans. What is the sense that you have got from your customers, especially Exports? What is your order book size at the moment? Have you noticed any slowdown in orderbook in Q2? If Export demand sees a decline, what are the plans to counter this risk? Can domestic market absorb additional sales? How do you see margins playing out for the rest of the yearFY12? **

5). Erode âManufacturing Plant on 12.5 Acres

Mott MacDonald, the global engineering and development consultancy has been appointed as EPCM consultants for this plant.

**The stakes seem to be very high for this plant! Kindly tell us a little more on what is planned and what kind of sophistication/productivity efficiencies is this likely to bring? What kind of capacities are planned at this facility in total? **What is the timeline for the first phase of expansion? Is this facility going to be dedicated for Butyl reclaims as reported in the press, or this will be multi-product?

6). Thermoplastics foray

Reportedly, this is a very exciting space and has huge potential. Kindly share the developments in this space? Any major successes? How much does this contribute to revenues today?

**7). **Customer segments - GRRPL products are approved at 7of the top 12 tyre companies in theworld and 4 of the top 10 non-tyrerubber makers globally.

Kindly share recent customer successes and or deeper penetration into existing accounts. Have more marquee names been added to the list?

Given the focus on synthetic reclaim rubber are we seeing more penetration in that segment? Who are your top customers in this segment?

How much does your top 3 customers contribute to Sales? Does any one customer contribute more than 10% of Sales?

8). Investor Relations âCommunication

GRRPL needs to improve communication with the investor community at large. The website does not provide even the Annual Reports.

With the company growing in size and stature, are we going to see a more proactive IR at GRRPL. Can we expect regular Analyst Calls & Presentations form the company updating investors on its successes, opportunities and challenges ahead?

**9). **Small Equity base. Low liquidity

At 1.33 Cr the equity base is pretty low and average liquidity/volumes traded (1000) is also low.

Does the company plan to do something on this front to allow more investors to participate in GRRPLâs stock story â splits/bonuses, etc. Any plans on listing in NSE?

**10). **Major opportunities & Challenges

Where does Gujarat Reclaim see itself in the next 5 years? What is the size of the opportunity in its niche? Will it improve its position among the top 3 global suppliers of reclaim rubber? Can we see GRRPL reach 500 Cr Sales, by when? What are the major challenges before the company and where are the big opportunities?

hi guys,

Any idea when the responses to our questions will be posted?

cheers,

Subbu

Subbu,

Am back in Bangalore tomorrow. Should be able to talk to Viraj and update in a couple of days.

Please bear till then.

Donald

Hi Guys,

Gujarat Reclaim Management Q&A, 25 Aug 2011updated. Another good example of enriching collaborative work among ValuePickr members.

Key Notables:

1). 80% of Export Sales is from Europe. Company maintains as of now, they haven’t seen any slackening in demand of Export Sales

2). The demand is so robust that if they had 80,000 MTPA production today, they would be able to sell that

3). Raw material/Scrap sourcing is not a problem. The total scrap availability is something like 4-5x the total reclaim production in the country.

Please carry forward the discussion.

-Donald

Need one clarification. The management says that overall reclaim rubber market is about 8% of the Indian rubber industry. Now the only factor due to which end users prefer reclaim rubber is the cost benefit over natural rubber. Other than this factor, is there any other reason why the % of usage of reclaim rubber should go up? Though I may be wrong, I just get a feeling that the company is trying to increase its market share by expansion. Is this a case of having a larger share in the pie or are we going to see the pie being increased? In case of former, we may see steady growth due to expansion in the next 18 months or so followed by another long period of stagnated growth. In case this is true, will it call for PE ratio expansion?

Great work guys!!!. Ill go through the interview in detail and get back to the forum.